Tinyg causing Power Supply to shut down

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  • August 21, 2020 at 2:50 am #11854
    pereira.newton@ymail.com
    Participant

    Hi Guys,

    I’m facing a weird issue all of a sudden with my Tinyg.

    Context:
    I was using my Tinyg and had to use the emergency kill of the power. I restarted the power and press the reset on the Tinyg G, I also flushed the queue from Chillpeppr.

    Issue:
    After I did the above, mentioned in the context, the power supply(24V DC) shutdown and Tinyg does not power up.

    When I disconnect the Tinyg from the power supply the power supply works on. This proves Power Supply is working fine. The moment I connect Tinyg to the power supply and switch on, the power supply shuts down.

    Before the power supply shuts down, the green, blue and red led on the Tinyg blink once and then the power supply shuts down.

    This entire issue is happening with and without any load\driver\motors attached to the Tinyg.

    Assumptions:
    Something wired is happening in the Tinyg causing the power supply to overload and shutdown.

    Please do let me know if anyone has experienced this and a possible way to solve this.

    August 21, 2020 at 7:16 am #11855
    cmcgrath5035
    Moderator

    I recognize you from previous threads as working on a set-up using external drivers, at least partially. Some comments/suggestions will assume you were successful in implementing them.

    A first comment would be that your power supply working without load does not necessarily mean that the PS is OK. Most modern transformerless DC supplies have automatic shutdown circuits that disable the supply in over-current situations. It is possible that the output protection circuit was damaged by the emergency shutdown.
    You need to load test your 24V supply with a known good load, such as a DC motor (not stepper)

    Another quick test would be to completely disconnect tinyG from your setup then try powering up the tinyG in total isolation. A naked tinyG requires only a few 10s of milliamps to boot up when there are no external connections. Find an old wall wart supply in the 10V to 24V range, verify polarity, and see if tinyG will boot in total isolation, including leaving the USB disconnected, just Input Power and Ground.
    Connecting power should produce the boot-up LED flashing sequence followed by a brief (default 2 sec) all green LEDs on, then extinguish.
    If tinyG fails this naked boot-up, then something on the board has failed.
    Diagnosis of such a failure will be difficult, should you want to try here is a link to the Schematics
    https://github.com/synthetos/TinyG/tree/master/hardware/v8schematics/v8h

    August 23, 2020 at 12:41 am #11856
    pereira.newton@ymail.com
    Participant

    Hi cmcgrath5035,
    Yes Its me 🙂

    With regards to the external drivers connecting to Tinyg I have just received the level shifter and will find a weekend to implement it… I need to find a wiring diagram for it on the Internet. Will keep u posted on how I progress with it on the other thread.

    With regards to “Tinyg causing power supply to overload.”

    I have done a few test:

    Test 1:
    Connect Power Supply with out load
    Outcome: Power Supply is working and is turning On

    Test 2:
    Connect Power Supply to Tinyg which has the issue. Calling it T1.
    Outcome: Tinyg causing the Power Supply to shutdown.

    Test 3:
    Connect Power Supply to new Tinyg, calling it T2.
    Outcome: The new Tinyg turn on and is working.

    Test 4:
    Connect T1 to a different power supply.
    Outcome: Tinyg doesn’t turn on.

    I have a video recorded them and can send across it…. I don’t know how to attach a video to this post.

    August 23, 2020 at 8:40 am #11857
    cmcgrath5035
    Moderator

    Best way to attach pictures and other large documents is to copy them to a cloud drive (Gdrive, etc.) and post a URL link here.

    I am not sure a video would be helpful here.

    Based on your Test results, I have to agree with you that it appear T(inyG)1 has failed.
    Not at all clear what might have happened.

    Diagnosis on boards like this is difficult and repair(device replacement) more )so.

    August 23, 2020 at 11:44 pm #11858
    pereira.newton@ymail.com
    Participant

    hmmm… thanks for your response and guidance cmcgrath5035…..

    I guess u will have to start using T2…..

    August 29, 2020 at 8:13 am #11863
    pereira.newton@ymail.com
    Participant

    Hi cmcgrath5035,

    Im now facing a issue with the new Tinyg…..

    So follow is the context, situation, and issue.

    So after declaring Tinyg(T1) issue to be too difficult to debug, I decided to use the brand new Tinyg(T2).

    I soldered wires to J17, J18, J19; Dir and Step. Then I connected the power supply.

    I powered on T2 then:
    1) the blue power Led went On.
    2) the red led of Spindle blinked a few times and stopped.
    3) the PWM red led turned on and stayed on.
    I take this as that the Tinyg booted up well and is working.
    4) Then I connect my laptop to the Tinyg

    and…. the T2 doesn’t get detected by my laptop. T1 used to get detected until the overloading issue happened…..

    So then…..
    I connected another laptop to Tinyg and it was not getting detected. I installed and reinstalled the driver and followed the process mentioned here
    https://github.com/synthetos/TinyG/wiki/Connecting-TinyG#establish-usb-connection
    but still the Tinyg is not getting detected……

    to test the usb cable, I tried to connect an ardunio and it was getting detected… that proved the cable was good….

    So in short the new Tinyg T2 is not getting detected on a laptop on which T1 was getting detected.

    Not sure why?

    Please can you guide me……

    I have tried this on a Windows and Mac laptop…..

    August 29, 2020 at 9:50 am #11865
    cmcgrath5035
    Moderator

    The boot up sequence 1 – 3 you describe is correct as you have described it for the default parameter set. You can modify step 3 behavior (turn off the LED) with a change to parameter $p1pof, if you are not using the PWM spindle interface it does not matter.

    It’s too late now, I would not have recommended soldering directly to the J17-J19 pins, there are numerous hobbyist prototype lead sets that will push on to these individual pins.
    Soldering directly to any interface introduces the potential of ESD damage to the devices.

    You seem to have done the right things for you windows machine, have you tried all the available USB Ports on your PC?

    Open the Windows device manager app, which will eneumerate the connected USB devices. Observe the list as you insert the tinyG cable, then refresh the list. If you see no changes in device manager, the new USB hardware being connected is not being detected, independent of driver. tinyG uses an FTDI device as the USB interface.
    That interface is similar to Arduino Uno, so if that is what you tested then it should work for tinyG.
    Watch the device manager as you connect the UNO to get familiar with the process.

    If you can’t get the device to show in Device Manager, something is very wrong.

    August 29, 2020 at 10:04 am #11866
    pereira.newton@ymail.com
    Participant

    Hi cmcgrath5035,

    Yeah I have tried now with 3 different laptops….2 Windows and 1 Mac all resulted in the same outcome on all the USB ports.

    I can connect my Arduino Mega and can see it in the USB list on the device manager side.

    but when I connect the Tinyg the list doesn’t refresh…. 🙁

    having the worst possible luck……

    not sure what to do to get it detected…… given the boot up sequence is working I’m assuming the board is not damaged…..

    August 29, 2020 at 12:30 pm #11867
    cmcgrath5035
    Moderator

    Earlier in this thread you reported

    Test 3:
    Connect Power Supply to new Tinyg, calling it T2.
    Outcome: The new Tinyg turn on and is working.

    I guess that did not include connecting to your control computer.

    The USB interface on the tinyG board is defined by an FTDI to serial converter chip.
    The FTDI should be considered to be hardware, it does not participate in the boot process and proper functionality of the FTDI device is not tested until you attempt a connection, as you are now.

    Think back to the situation that needed to be stopped with the Emergency stop. What laptop process were you running to send Gcode to the tinyG that needed to be stopped?

    August 29, 2020 at 7:56 pm #11868
    pereira.newton@ymail.com
    Participant

    Hi cmcgrath5035,

    yeah with Test 3, I just powered it on and didn’t think of connecting to the laptop. I didn’t think that an unused Tinyg would not getting dedetced by the laptop.

    With Regards to the Emergency Stop:

    I was performing a milling action with my CNC. I was using a MacBook Air Laptop. I was using Chillipper to send the Gcode to Tinyg…

    I hit the freehold, then reset, then estop, then disconnected the usb…. this all happened quite fast and I don’t remember the exact sequence…

    I feel with T1:
    The board has got stuck in a state that believes its still performing some action, that is causing it to drive load. If there is some way to wipe out that state and get it back to normal, the T1 will start working again.

    I feel with T2:
    Quite had to believe a unused Tinyg would not get detected… feels like there is some basic step that I’m not doing with this.

    August 30, 2020 at 8:37 am #11869
    cmcgrath5035
    Moderator

    OK, I now know you are fluent in Mac and Windows and were using Chilipeppr.

    First – as far as I can tell, your tinyG1 is dead, because it fails the naked boot.

    Let’s focus on tinyG2. Is your inability to see the USB connection based on looking at the Chilipeppr GUI?

    Why do I ask?
    I assume you know that SPJS needs to be running for the CP GUI to see the tinyG.
    Back in early August, I can’t easily determine the date, SPJS stopped working because Google terminated underlying support for a webapi that SPJS used. SPJS had to be rebuilt by it’s author, John Lauer.
    If you have been using Chilipeppr to test your tinyG2, you need to determine if SPJS is actually running on your computers.
    Your activity seems to bridge the timeframe in which Google created this mess for SPJS. You need to look hard to see if SPJS is actually running. Google Search is your friend, I have no experience with this current fiasco, but amm seeing it playout on the Chilipeppr forums.

    As an alternative, you could try cnc.js.

    • This reply was modified 4 years, 4 months ago by cmcgrath5035.
    August 30, 2020 at 7:17 pm #11871
    pereira.newton@ymail.com
    Participant

    Hi cmcgrath5035,

    Following are the test I have done, but still T2 doesn’t appear as a device on my laptops.

    1) Arduino -> Serial Port Json -> Chillipeppr Grbl: I could see the serial port connection on the serial port json server, on both the laptops.

    2) Arduino -> CNCJS: I could see the serial port connection on the dropdowns on CNCJS; Connections, on both the laptops.

    3) Tinyg -> Serial Port Json -> Chillipeppr Tinyg: I could not see the serial port connection on the serial port json server, on both the laptops.
    on Mac all I see is “/dev/tty.Bluetooth-Incoming-Port”
    on Windows all I see is no serial port connections

    4) Tinyg -> CNCJS: I could not see the serial port connection on the dropdowns on CNCJS; Connections, on both the laptops.
    on Mac all I see is “/dev/tty.Bluetooth-Incoming-Port”
    on Windows all I see is empty drop down.

    August 31, 2020 at 8:58 am #11872
    cmcgrath5035
    Moderator

    I assume your Arduino test is with a Mega? As said above, I believe that Mega has native USB interface and connects with a different driver than the FTDI.
    So the above tests could imply a missing FTDI driver, which is what you need to interface tinyG.

    But you indicated that the proper driver was loaded.

    If you have a voltmeter, you could check that

    This is the applicable schematic page
    https://github.com/synthetos/TinyG/blob/a364308c8800ee2fb2227bb83f5d8edce0aae304/hardware/v8schematics/v8d/tinyGv8d%20-%20schematic%20page1.pdf

    The FT230X device interfaces the USB, converts to serial.
    Look closely on your tinyG2 for solder drips or ?? around that device.

    September 1, 2020 at 6:28 pm #11873
    pereira.newton@ymail.com
    Participant

    ok will do…. don’t have a voltmeter will need to buy one…..

    yeah the Arduino was a Mega….

    Was wondering if there is a way to bypass the on board FTDI driver? On the board I see J14 with 4 holes…. can that be used to bypass FTDI?

    I have a Raspberry Pi which I can use I guess to play the role of FTDI to send serial information to the Tinyg….

    worth a Hack? please do let me know what you reckon…..

    September 1, 2020 at 10:22 pm #11874
    pereira.newton@ymail.com
    Participant

    found this
    https://synthetos.comtopics/tinyg-raspberry-pi

    will try it out

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