6040 CNC w/ TinyG V9 – odd axis stall at end of move

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  • #9703
    MaxFrenzy
    Member

    I have a 6040 CNC that is setup with a tinyG V9 board for testing/development. I’m working on another GUI that I’ll discuss later, but for now I was just using chilipeppr to try to work out some kinks. Video Link: YouTube video

    There seems to be an issue with the Y axis (long axis a.k.a – moving gantry) stalling/crunching at the END of motion. This is confusing particularly because it is a single line of code, sent from the chilipeppr macro feature…just doing a G1 x0 y500 F2000 or F2500, and it would seem that stalling would occur as it tries to hit a max velocity that is too much for the machine. I’ve uploaded a video and you’ll notice how the stepper stalls out at the end of the command when the gantry is slowing itself to a stop. Some basic settings for the axis, which remember are not being maxed out as the feedrate is specified in the single line of gcode.

    $ct=0.01
    $ja=200000
    $xjd=0.05
    $yjd=0.05
    $zjd=0.05
    $1sa=1.8
    $2sa=1.8
    $3sa=1.8
    $1po=0
    $2po=0
    $3po=1
    $1tr=5
    $2tr=5
    $3tr=5
    $1mi=8
    $2mi=8
    $3mi=8
    $xvm=3048 (using slower speeds for testing)
    $yvm=3048
    $zvm=3048
    $xfr=3048
    $yfr=3048 (using slower speeds for testing though these speeds work fine on x/z)
    $zfr=1524
    $xjm=50
    $yjm=50 (tried turning it down to 20, then to 10)
    $zjm=50
    $xjh=100
    $yjh=100
    $zjh=100

    Any ideas would be appreciated. I am dealing with noise issues related to the VFD that I’m working through, but the VFD is off for these basic movements. If the stepper is able to accelerate up to speed ok, traverse across the table, why can’t it slow down appropriately? Now, I do realize I’m using 3A nema 23s on the 6040 and maxing out the TI drvs at 2.5A @ 24v. However, they aren’t even warm to the touch and I’m only moving a single axis at the moment (with no cutting load).

    Thanks
    Matt

    #9707
    cmcgrath5035
    Moderator

    Please post your entire parameter set to a cloud drive with URL – answers a lot of potential questions ($fb, $_pl, etc).

    Video is odd, for sure.
    Any chance there is some residual binding in the drive train – if $mt=1, perhaps the additional jump is due to motor release after 1 second

    If you energise the Y motor, can you manually push the gantry, overcoming the holding torque?

    Same result if you make the y move at half the velocity? Twice?

    #9714
    MaxFrenzy
    Member

    Here is a link to my full $$ output
    Link

    Motor timeout was set to 2 seconds. Tried bumping it up to 4 seconds, but no change. Power to steppers is set to max (1), Power up when in cycle. I also switched the settings to run Y off a different driver, but had the same result.

    As for energizing the motors and moving the gantry. Generally I try to avoid moving any axis manually when it’s plugged in and powered to prevent back feeding power to the drivers. Given that this is my first ball screw machine (my others are rack/pinion), I’m not really sure what the “rules” are for pushing it around when disconnected and what sort of force should be expected. However, I did try to manual move it with the stepper disconnected from the control board. It’s actually requires a good amount of force to push the gantry back/forth. With my luck, I got a feeling that there is something binding up, but I’m not sure the best way to go about fixing it. I noticed that one of the linear bearings on the underside of the gantry had it’s jump/spring ring tucked behind the round black flange piece that normally is behind the ring. I was able to snap it back in place and then unscrewed the block from the gantry to make sure it was able to slide along the rail ok. I can adjust the preload on the linear bearings with a set screw and found them to be tightened down lightly (not loose, but easy to break free and unscrew) I’m not really sure how to make adjustments to the ball nut setup on that axis…if there is a preload adjustment or if I could unscrew the main nut and test to see if the machine slides back and forth freely. I really don’t want to end up having the ball bearings dump out. I did notice that ball nut had a little screw that seems to be for lubricant. Speaking of which, there isn’t a HEAVY coat of lube but it’s certainly slick. I may give it a squirt anyway for shts*giggles. Ultimately I know that the 4 linear bearings (2 per side) and ball screw (middle) should be as parallel as possible. It would be nice to know the typical adjustment or starting points for squaring/alignment.

    Oh lastly, slowing down the speed seems to help but there does still seem to be a somewhat abrupt stop at the end. Not the stalling/crunching/jumping necessarily that you find at the “faster” rates. I got the impression there is something going on mechanically, but hopefully you’ll have some suggestions.

    Thanks

    #9715
    cmcgrath5035
    Moderator

    I compared your parameters to a set I last used form my SH2 belt machine.
    I have $fb=83.09, whereas you have 87.01. I don’t think that is an issue.

    The other differences are $_pl, $_tr and the jerk values, all different due to different mechanical configs. Again, I think $yjm=50 might be on the low side for you, but believe you have already experimented with $yjm=100 or perhaps 200.

    I have no hands on experience with your mechanical setup, but sort of understand the adjustments you are speaking of.

    I might suggest mechanically disconnecting the Y axis motor from the ballscrew, then observing the motor when you issue the move command. Based on your video, the secondary ‘jump’ at end of travel should be visible if it is tinyG related.
    Perhaps you can just back out the ballscrew side setscrew(s) on the coupler and run the move?

    #9728
    MaxFrenzy
    Member

    I wanted to update a couple things to post findings. I have a buddy that is running a shopbot control card that is essentially their SAM board for running G2 w/ external gecko 250x drivers, 3.5A steppers, 48v psu. He was having similar issues with his x axis on his microcarve cnc. They weren’t nearly as pronounced as mine but it was at the deceleration point as he moved his x axis back and forth. His settings are relatively modest, similar to mine with jerk values set at either 50 or 100. Here is a video of his YouTube Link

    Regarding mine, I tried removing the stepper from the coupler to test without any load and had the same results. The stepper seems to handle the higher speed rates but locks up at slower rates. Doesn’t make much sense to me. I replaced the power supply in the machine as well as swapping out the stepper motor from the x axis with the Y and found the same behavior on the Y axis. Just to test some more, I hooked up an arduino uno to a Tb6560ahq driver that came with the 6040 and ran the motor off an atx power supply @ 24v. While I couldn’t achieve the same top speeds (not enough juice from the atx psu I assume), I didn’t have any issues running the stepper at various speeds. I don’t know what the max speed in mm/min the 6040 CNC 3A steppers with a tinyG v9 TI 8825 2.5A drivers are supposed to be, but the concern is obvious that these higher jog/rapid speeds are fun but cutting is going to happen at lower rates. I’ll write a few macros and try to nail down the exact range where the motor locks up. Any other ideas? Drop down to fb=83.09?

    Thanks

    #9729
    cmcgrath5035
    Moderator

    You should give $fb=83.09 a try, I suppose. $fb=87.01 was an interim update that got posted on Chilipeppr, I believe. It is not real clear what G2 users are using most these days.

    Fact is, most heavy G2 users are doing custom builds, so very difficult to determine what they might have.

    If you see similar behavior with $fb=83.09, might be a good idea to enter an Issue here:

    with a link to parameter sets and your videos

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